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Old 02-26-2008, 09:21 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Porsche, Racing For The "Green"

This is an interesting piece on how Porsche will decide in the future as to whether or not to race. Customer programs are the driving force behind what they do.

Going For The Green
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Old 02-26-2008, 10:12 PM   #2 (permalink)
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This is an interesting piece on how Porsche will decide in the future as to whether or not to race. Customer programs are the driving force behind what they do.

Going For The Green
Interesting read.

It touched on something I've thought about over the last few years regarding the speculation that the LMP2 effort was a pre-cursor to a Factory LMP1 effort. I've always wondered: what would be involved, technically, in a switch to P1? Is it as simple as more weight/more power/and a few other minor adjustments?

Or would a wholesale chassis re-design also be involved?
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Old 02-27-2008, 10:58 AM   #3 (permalink)
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I think that this is a good piece from the perspective of a confessed Audi fan.
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Old 02-27-2008, 01:23 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I think that this is a good piece from the perspective of a confessed Audi fan.


I think it is a pretty good perspective of the Porsche business/racing model period.
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Old 02-27-2008, 09:06 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Very good. Somebody actually did some research and independent thinking to make some insightful observations.
It really does make you wonder why BMW or maybe some other manufacturers couldn't follow the same model of building customer cars and making money with it... or at least not losing money. It is a win win if you make money, you make money and you promote your brand. It is a win if you don't lose money because you promoted your brand without spending any money. How could that not be something looked at very seriously by manufacturers.

What about that new VW series? Does the Porsche involvement with VAG have anything to do with that? Is VW learning from Porsche?
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Old 02-28-2008, 04:56 AM   #6 (permalink)
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I think it is a pretty good perspective of the Porsche business/racing model period.
Yes, and you, just as I do, have every right to think the way you do.

Although the article is intelligently written, there are some issues that I have with it.

Trey writes the following:
“…and yet Porsche defeated Audi in eight out of ten events with a supposedly lesser class of car”.
Well there is not “supposedly” involved here. The RS Spyder is a LMP2 car and the Audi is a LMP1 car.
As much as it hurts Audi fans to admit it, the RS Spyder is a car build according to the LMP2 rules which are a “lesser” class to the LMP1 rules. No “supposedly”; just a fact.

He goes on to say:

Would a further 20% interest in VAG force Porsche to pull the plug on their support of Penske Racing’s RS Spyders and let Audi have its way in the ALMS as Oursler suggests? I don’t quite follow that logic.

Well, Oursler’s logic is that given Porsches (forecasted) level of financial interest in VAG, it would make more “financial” sense not to beat the Audi’s as this would reduce their marketing effectiveness and thus impacting potential future sales. As Audi sells more cars than Porsche does, the negative financial impact would be greater.

When talking of the LMP1 2000 project he states the following:
The answer is really quite simple: the LMP-00 was cancelled due to the lack of a credible market for a customer LMP1 car”.

I’m not sure how one can be so sure of this. From my understanding, the program was cancelled before potential customers were even aware of its existence.


He also writes the following:
Now that Audi is racing for the Piech and Porsche branches of the Porsche family, and now that Wiedeking is in charge of seeing to the brand’s financial health, does he really want to see Porsche beat Audi?”
And that really is the correct question to ask: does it serve any purpose (financially) for Porsche to compete directly against Audi on the track? If you believe as I do that the answer to that question is a resounding “No”, then it only helps Porsche’s cause for the ALMS to slow the LMP2 class relative to LMP1.

Yes I'm sure he does belive it's "No". He, along with all the other Audi fans.

Perhaps the question he should be asking is it beneficial for Porsche, the only real sports car manufacturer in the group, to be seen on the world stage to be constantly beaten by a non-sporstcar manufacturer with a diesel.
What's the medium to long term effects on the brand (Porsche) and what will be the financial results of this?

As Trey stated at the start off the piece: “Racing is the lifeblood of Porsche. Whereas other manufacturers race every few years at Le Mans to garner a marketing benefit, sportscar racing is a business vital to the bottom line of Porsche’s corporate operations.”
The only thing I'll add to this is that it's not just racing, it's winning!
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Old 02-28-2008, 12:39 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spyderman View Post
Yes, and you, just as I do, have every right to think the way you do.

Although the article is intelligently written, there are some issues that I have with it.

Trey writes the following:
“…and yet Porsche defeated Audi in eight out of ten events with a supposedly lesser class of car”.
Well there is not “supposedly” involved here. The RS Spyder is a LMP2 car and the Audi is a LMP1 car.
As much as it hurts Audi fans to admit it, the RS Spyder is a car build according to the LMP2 rules which are a “lesser” class to the LMP1 rules. No “supposedly”; just a fact.

He goes on to say:

Would a further 20% interest in VAG force Porsche to pull the plug on their support of Penske Racing’s RS Spyders and let Audi have its way in the ALMS as Oursler suggests? I don’t quite follow that logic.

Well, Oursler’s logic is that given Porsches (forecasted) level of financial interest in VAG, it would make more “financial” sense not to beat the Audi’s as this would reduce their marketing effectiveness and thus impacting potential future sales. As Audi sells more cars than Porsche does, the negative financial impact would be greater.

When talking of the LMP1 2000 project he states the following:
The answer is really quite simple: the LMP-00 was cancelled due to the lack of a credible market for a customer LMP1 car”.

I’m not sure how one can be so sure of this. From my understanding, the program was cancelled before potential customers were even aware of its existence.


He also writes the following:
Now that Audi is racing for the Piech and Porsche branches of the Porsche family, and now that Wiedeking is in charge of seeing to the brand’s financial health, does he really want to see Porsche beat Audi?”
And that really is the correct question to ask: does it serve any purpose (financially) for Porsche to compete directly against Audi on the track? If you believe as I do that the answer to that question is a resounding “No”, then it only helps Porsche’s cause for the ALMS to slow the LMP2 class relative to LMP1.

Yes I'm sure he does belive it's "No". He, along with all the other Audi fans.

Perhaps the question he should be asking is it beneficial for Porsche, the only real sports car manufacturer in the group, to be seen on the world stage to be constantly beaten by a non-sporstcar manufacturer with a diesel.
What's the medium to long term effects on the brand (Porsche) and what will be the financial results of this?

As Trey stated at the start off the piece: “Racing is the lifeblood of Porsche. Whereas other manufacturers race every few years at Le Mans to garner a marketing benefit, sportscar racing is a business vital to the bottom line of Porsche’s corporate operations.”
The only thing I'll add to this is that it's not just racing, it's winning!
And yet when the ACO make changes to the rules, to adjust the formula and make sure that the rules reflect that there are actual class (performance) differences, the anti-Audi fans go ballistic.
It can be painted anyway you like, but the facts are clearly evident.
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Old 02-29-2008, 02:01 AM   #8 (permalink)
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I'm not sure exactly what your point is, but an "anti-Audi" fan didn't write the article.
It might surprise you to learn that I'm not anti-Audi but rather anti the pro-diesel rules.
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Old 02-29-2008, 04:36 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
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I'm not sure exactly what your point is, but an "anti-Audi" fan didn't write the article.
It might surprise you to learn that I'm not anti-Audi but rather anti the pro-diesel rules.
Hmm, I never implied in any way what so ever that Trey was anti-Audi!
I do not know that I would qualify pro-Porsche Spyder as anti-diesel. Since also in the mix is the consideration that the rules adjustments also addressed the petrol P-1's vs. the
P-2's.
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